KENNY JOHNSON Interview
Kenny Johnson Stars as “Kozik” in SONS OF ANARCHY
Watch SONS OF ANARCHY on Tuesday Nights at 10 PM EST on FX
November 30, 2010
By Lena Lamoray
FX NETWORK PR: Kenny Johnson, who we all remember from another FX series, The Shield. He plays Kozik and his character was a member of SAMCRO in the Tacoma, Washington chapter. He wanted to changed charters and come to Charming. As a reminder, one thing that happened this season, he did not get voted in as a member because Tig would not vote him in. The reason behind this is that Tig and Kozik had some bad blood and shared a love of a very precious girl, I’ll put it that way.
I spoke with KENNY JOHNSON about his role as “Kozik” on SONS OF ANARCHY. He was amazing to speak with and certainly a fun guy that I would NOT want to arm wrestle. It seems to me that CHARLIE HUNNAM “Jax” is the set instigator. I was a fan of Kenny’s work in “The Shield” of course but I really loved his character in “Just Shoot Me!” because really, who doesn’t want to punch “Dennis Finch” aka David Spade in the face? Don’t miss the season three finale of SONS OF ANARCHY tonight on FX.
Lena Lamoray: Were you a fan of the show prior to signing on and how has your experience been so far with the cast and working with Kurt Sutter?
KENNY JOHNSON: Yes, I was definitely a fan of the show. I went to the premier of the first season and I love it, I loved it. I fell in love with the cast, everybody. Katie was amazing. I love Perlman. Charlie was amazing. All the guys were amazing. I was super impressed that Kurt actually cast this group together because it just seems to fit perfect. I get along with everybody great. I came on, I was little tentative a little bit for a second just because I didn’t want to overstep any boundaries because I didn’t know these guys. But in Perlman that comes off as big, tough, grizzly dude is like one of the softest, nicest, funny guys in the world. He has the craziest, dry sense of humor and Charlie is as crazy as they come. At the same time, these guys are amazing actors with great work ethics. Everybody trusts each other, which is great. There’s no arguments or fights about scenes or interpretation. Everyone does their own thing. It’s not like The Shield, but even maybe more effortless. Instead of like with three core people that I felt, Walton, myself, and Michael Chiklis, this is like with ten guys that kind of ping pong off of each other and are just pretty phenomenal actors. Kurt has been great to me. I’ve known him since like the beginning of The Shield. I think it’s an amazing show that he wrote. I get along really well with him. I feel like it’s my family and FX is like my family. It just feels like I’m back home, so I love it.
Lena Lamoray: What is it like filming the fight scenes with Kim and if you fought in real life, who do you think would win and why?
KENNY JOHNSON: Man, well, should I say the truth? Yes, okay, I’ll be truthful. The fight scenes have been really fun. At the very beginning, I love fighting. I’ve been boxing for five years and I’ve never had anyone do my own stunts ever. So when the fight scene came up, the first one with Kim, I was just all gung ho to do it. Then Kim comes over and says “Listen, let’s get the stunt guys to do this because there’s no need to put ourselves in a dangerous situation.” I kind of looked at him and I walked away. I was talking to some of the other guys and I go, “He doesn’t want to do this fight scene. I’m doing it. He doesn’t have to do it, but I’m definitely doing it.” He found out that I was definitely doing it, and so then obviously he changed his mind. We choreographed this thing probably like 100 times before we did it. So he just kept grabbing me and saying, “Listen, Johnson, Johnson, we have to be careful. We don’t want to get hurt. Nobody needs to get hurt. Just be careful whatever you do.” He kept warning me about we have to be careful. So nothing happened until the very, very last take where we kind of run at each other in the pool room and then it cuts away to the beginning of the intro to SOA. I accidentally ran full speed and my arm got caught under his neck, so he dropped to his knees and he was kind of screaming and hollering and going crazy. It was really kind of frightening because I thought I shattered his jaw or something the way he was reacting. I didn’t know. Then I found out later on that I obviously accidently my bicep hit underneath his Adam’s apple and his neck. He couldn’t breathe or whatever. So that happened by accident. In a real fight, he’s a strong guy, he’s a tough guy. I can tell. Like you grab him, he’s a strong guy. He works out, but I would say I would kick his ass. Truthfully, I think in real life, but as characters, I don’t know. As characters, it’s pretty even as you could tell or I’m the one that has more bruises than he does. I don’t want to offend anyone by saying I’d kick his ass, but—
Scott Seomin FX Network PR: But you just did.
KENNY JOHNSON: Exactly. All the Tig lovers, they’re like, “Hey, Kozik now.”
Scott Seomin FX Network PR: Also this is a good point I wanted to— Kenny, if you could remind folks of the titles that you’ve in the unique world of arm wrestling just to give an example of how strong you are because you are a strong mother.
KENNY JOHNSON: Back in the day, I was ranked second in the world in arm wrestling in my weight class. But I have to say that was amateur and not professional. At pros, I was probably number eight in the world. I played college football and baseball, so I guess Scott thinks that I’m strong.
Scott Seomin FX Network PR: I like that he downplays the words in the world. Ranked number eight in the world in arm wrestling as if that’s not a big deal. I am going to agree that Kenny Johnson could kick Kim Coates’ ass, I only say this because the season has wrapped and I won’t see Kim probably. He’s in Canada shooting a movie, so he won’t see either one of us for a while, Kenny, so I think we’re—
KENNY JOHNSON: If you ever get a chance to ask Charlie, because Charlie is convinced that he thinks I could kill anyone on the set. He constantly reminds the guys of that, but he always gets everyone really riled up. So when I walk in the room, everyone is all tense and Charlie is laughing. He goes, “Kenny, everyone is pissed at you right now because I told them that I think that you could kill anyone here,” so thanks, Charlie. I don’t know. Who knows, man? Who knows?
More conference call interview highlights:
Q: I am so enjoying your arc on this series. I love how you fill out a cut. So I’m curious; Missy is between you and Tig. I want to know how two bikers, two manly bikers, are sharing a dog. Can you explain that mythology?
KENNY JOHNSON: … mythology, we didn’t know she was a dog until the week that we shot that scene that she was a dog. So the whole time, we thought it was … and it was somebody that maybe lost their lives, whether it be his sister or an ex-girlfriend of his that he was blaming me. So that’s kind of what we thought. That’s what Kurt told us. He said that, but even deeper. He goes, “Go as deep as you can and think really dark,” so that’s kind of where we went. So when the dog came up, I had to come up with a whole … beyond the argument. So I don’t know yet. I can tell you what I think happened to Missy, but I don’t think that would be fair because it might actually be revealed later on and I don’t want to get it wrong.
Q: Are we going to see Kozik in season four? Please say yes.
KENNY JOHNSON: I would love to say yes. I can say I don’t think I die before the end of this season, which is a good thing. I talked to Kurt on the phone and everything kind of points to that direction that it would make sense that I would come back, so I’m hoping, so I’m hoping. I think it’s favorable, definitely.
Q: There’s a group of us TV writers, female, that are taking bets on who manscapes in the SAMCRO club. We think that you’re at the top of the leader board with Juice right behind .Yes, because you have highlights in your hair and you look like you ….
KENNY JOHNSON: Oh, God. You’re not supposed to notice the highlights. That’s funny. I don’t know. I’m not going to answer that. That was funny.
Q: You’re in a cast with a variety of the most interesting and fun character actors that I’ve personally loved for the past 15, 20 years, just a bunch of great regular guys thrust together. You get to play a lot of scenes against one of the big boys in Kim Coates. I wanted to get an idea how you guys achieved that dynamic that you have. That feels really palpable, the tension between the two of you. What’s Kim like as a guy offset and how do you guys get that dynamic to work?
KENNY JOHNSON: Chemistry I think is something that I guess it’s just there. Again, Kim Coates, his character, is such kind of bold, out there guy. He’s a Canadian guy. I married a Canadian. He’s so brass as a character and so— There’s something about it personally that I thought was going to work for me because I thought, “I want to hate this guy.” I go, I know so much on this guy that no one else knows and I just want to reveal it all inside of my head and let him know that I knew. It’s kind of easy to do. I mean, he’s an amazing actor. He’s completely in his character when he’s doing Tig. Off the set, he’s like the nicest guy in the world and it’s hard to not like him. So after the second week, he was such a good guy that I was starting to really work hard to have that angst and that tension against him. But I’m telling you when he’s in character, he’s like unapologetic and brass and just in your face kind of guy and it triggers me off. So I just try to play the character as true and genuine as I can the way Kurt writes it. I think the tension just sort of happens. We definitely get into stuff. He has a certain style of acting that also helps feed me. I’m not going to say what it is, but it definitely feeds me and we get into it a little bit. I’ll pull aside some people and talk about it, so we can get on the same page, but it’s really good. The tension is just naturally there between us, so I kind of dig that.
Q: It seems like the intensity is a recurring theme for you in terms of the shows that you’re on, at least in these two. Is the set of Sons of Anarchy a family type atmosphere or is there that machismo that pushes it forward?
KENNY JOHNSON: It’s like both, I think. I have to say the SOA family is so tight and so fun and yet so crazy. Like you say, all these actors are pretty amazing character actors and they have crazy personalities, a lot of them. Charlie will just run full speed and tackle somebody like Boone and he’ll knock him on his … in the middle of the road. Boone will get up and chase him and everybody kind of challenges each other, but it never gets to— It’s always in love, so it’s very crazy, yet safe in a fun family type of atmosphere in that respect, but not like—you know, family. There are a lot of different biker gangs that are there that are real biker gangs and has all the background and so I found the first week when I was there was really uncomfortable for me because I was in there with the real deal. I’m not only working with all these great actors that I didn’t know, which was really exciting and neat, but you have to feel your way in. At the same time, everybody in the background was from a real motorcycle gang or real porn stars or real whatever and they’re all there. It starts to feel like this is a whole other environment and world that I wasn’t used to. But then, probably two weeks into it, I felt like I knew these guys all my life and everybody was great.
Q: As someone who’s been a fan of yours since The Shield and Saving Grace, how is playing Kozik different from playing those characters on the other shows since you’ve played mostly law enforcement officials? Is it different?
KENNY JOHNSON: Yes, I find it— These are motorcycle outlaws, so there’s a little bit less of a conscience with what you do. Like playing Lem on The Shield, he was a guy that did dirty stuff and he had a conscience about it, which started eating away at him. Then on Saving Grace, you didn’t really break the rules, but you’re playing a cop that’s kind of out there and morally maybe not following a straight line with what he did. This character as far as I know is written where you don’t know if he’s a good guy or a bad guy, but he does what he does and I don’t think he feels bad about it. If you kill somebody or you take somebody out, it’s part of the job. It’s what you need to do to make your group function and be stronger. I think in other shows if I would have done that, there would have been a moral compass that maybe I struggled with more. Maybe this guy will later on, it depends on what Kurt does with it, but I think he supposed to be riding that line where you don’t know if he’s a really good guy or a really bad guy, but I don’t think he has a conscience really about what he does, if that makes any sense.
Q: Does Kozik have an old lady back home or is he single? What kind of woman would you see him with if a love interest did come into the show for him? What would you like to see?
KENNY JOHNSON: He’s single. The way I have it, he’s single, but maybe I’m wrong. Oh, man, wow. I hadn’t even thought of that. I can’t say.
Q: How stoked were you when you heard the news that you were going to become a series regular in the season three?
KENNY JOHNSON: Totally. I was totally stoked, man. I was totally excited about it. When I talked to Kurt and those guys, coming off of Saving Grace, which was Holly Hunter, so it was definitely geared around a female feminine energy and I really was, I don’t know, jonesing for something with a lot of balls to it. This show was great and I’m thankful that Kurt actually called and asked me to come on to do this. I was really happy, man. It’s the funnest [sic] gig. It’s effortless and I love it. I love riding bikes and I love the way Kurt writes, so I’m having a blast.
Q: Will we find out what happened to Missy that caused such a rift between Kozik and Tig in terms that Tig vehemently refuses to vote for Kozik into the club or won’t we?
KENNY JOHNSON: Man, that was something that came at us that week that we actually shot it. That it was a dog. So I think it will definitely get revealed what happened to her. Now that I’m thinking it was dog, there’s so many different things that could have happened and that he’s not getting over this. There’s probably a million things that he’d get over and not really give a … about, but for some reason, his best friend, Missy, this girl German Shepard, something bad happened to the dog that was obviously my fault. I think that will be revealed. I think it’s just going to be a slow reveal, whatever Kurt has in mind. I really can’t say because I have no idea what it is, but it’s probably going to be pretty dark and messed up, I would think.
Q; Is there any scoop you can give us on season four with the evolution of your character and not being voted in as a member of SAMCRO, for example, will Kozik be around, will Tig finally forgive, anything you can share?
KENNY JOHNSON: I wish I could tell you. I can’t. I know what Kurt has in mind for season four, but if I tell you, I think that might ruin what happens in the finale. So I kind of have to wait and let you watch the finale and then you’re going to be clear cut about what exactly where season four is going to go. I definitely could be back for season four if that’s what Kurt has in mind. I think it’s a pretty good possibility right now and you’ll find out everything by the end of the finale. That’s why I can’t really say.
Q: Could you tease the finale?
KENNY JOHNSON: Yes, I’ll tease it. There’s just payback. There’s a lot of crazy, crazy stuff that happens that I think people are going to be shocked. It kind of turns the world, the Charming around. It turns SOA around. I think season four is going to be so completely different from where it is right at this moment. I think everyone is going to be pretty shocked. When you see the beginning of season four, I’m almost sure there’s a time cut that it’s going to be a little bit into the future and everything is going to be really different. That’s all I can really say.
Scott Seomin FX Network PR: Do you think it’s fair to say that there’s some violence in the finale?
KENNY JOHNSON: Yes, something really violent. Half the town gets massacred and they burn the whole place. It’s like really crazy and there’s five people get drowned. It’s kind of really insane. It’s going to be really weird. Scott even comes on to guest star in this one.
Scott Seomin FX Network PR: That’s a quirk.
KENNY JOHNSON: … of course, with a swimsuit on.
Q: How did this all come about? You first appeared on the finale of season two, sitting on a barstool in the very beginning. I was like, “Oh, my God, it’s Lem!” How did this happen? Did Kurt call you up? Did he have you in mind for the role? Give us the details, please.
KENNY JOHNSON: Yes, I think he had a whiff of that the Saving Grace, the show I was on with TNT, was going to be cancelled. He asked me; he said, “If you have a second, can I throw you in—?” It was episode 12, not 13. He just said, “I want to introduce you as a character. Maybe next year if your show doesn’t go or whatever, I could maybe add you on as a guy. I’d love to at least do this as a cameo. Would you do it for me?” I’m like, “Yes, of course.” I had two days off, so it worked out perfect that I could just go on and play this character, Kozik. He goes, “I hope it works out. I’d love to have you come on and do an arc and who knows where it would go. It might be a few episodes. It might be more. It might if it works out, we could go and do more.” So I was glad that he actually— Kurt is a really good guy. He had met with me prior to doing this series. He had a movie that he was going to direct and write—or that he wrote and was going to direct—for Warner Brothers that it ended up not panning out for some reason. But he wanted me to play one of the characters in that. He kept saying, “I’d love to work with you. We will work together. I promise you we will work together.” A lot of people say that kind of stuff, but he actually kept his word. I feel really blessed that he developed this guy. So, yes, that’s how that came.
Q: What hurts more, riding around on a motorcycle for many, many hours a day or getting a grenade dropped into your crotch?
KENNY JOHNSON: Oh, that’s a tough question. The grenade sucked, especially under the conditions. Kim … slow death … grenade in the lap, that’s cool, by my best friend. Yes, definitely riding motorcycles is more uncomfortable.
Q: In regards to prep work, were you riding motorcycles before this? How did you get into this role? I know you’re a bit of an outsider when it came the whole MC world.
KENNY JOHNSON: Luckily I’ve owned four bikes, so I ride.
Q: What kind of bike do you ride?
KENNY JOHNSON: I have an 1100 Honda Shadow. It’s an old one that’s restored in like mint condition. That’s what I have. I don’t personally own a Harley, but I’ve owned two of those in the past and also back in the day when I was younger, I used to get like … 600 … just so I could race around. I grew up on a farm in Vermont and I used to have like a bike that I would dirt bike all the time all over the mountain. So I’ve ridden bikes, so luckily unlike a lot of—I shouldn’t say a lot, but a few of the guys in the cast have definitely dropped their bikes quite a bit. You would never know it watching it, but some of the guys endanger your life. So I’m always happy since I’m the new guy, that I’m in the back and I always make sure I’m back a little bit because I had some crazy stuff happen in front of me and I’m like, “Are you kidding me?” It’s pretty interesting.
Q: Who drops their bikes most? Come on, man, you have to tell us.
KENNY JOHNSON: Scott, can I tell them?
Scott Seomin FX Network PR: Yes, it is no secret, so tell them.
KENNY JOHNSON: I would say Ron Perlman dumps his bike the most. He’s the guy who will tell you that he doesn’t ride. He took lessons in between seasons this time to learn how to ride. Look, I’m not going to say what happens, but he’s definitely dropped the bike more than anybody. Even in the finale, twice he dumped his bike … probably going about 30 where he kind of panicked when the bike went down and hit the throttle. It can get scary. It can get scary.
Scott Seomin FX Network PR: Tommy Flanagan is a close second.
KENNY JOHNSON: He’s a close second. … is a great rider. I would give him $100,000 if he’d stop riding to work because I see him on the set, man, and Tommy is a nut. But in his mind, he thinks he’s ridden all his life, which he has not. It’s pretty apparent when you see, holy … buddy. It’s crazy—
Scott Seomin FX Network PR: Most of the guys do ride their bikes to the set in North Hollywood, but Ron Perlman rides in his BMW.
KENNY JOHNSON: Yes, and he brings a little dog, an old little dog. What kind of dog is that? He had a little—
Scott Seomin FX Network PR: It’s a little terrier.
KENNY JOHNSON: It’s so funny to watch him with that thing. That’s it. I’m not going to say anymore.
Q: Being such a physical actor and having that background that you do, we’re in an era now where people are starting to get back towards the action kind of roles where it’s actually athletic people playing the part. The everyman thing is kind of going away. Is there any sort of a passion that you have? Is there a project or is there a style of movie or show that really fits your dream project motif because you certainly—? You’re young enough to actually do it, which is nice, a nice change of pace, and you sell the physicality of it effectively. Do you have any aspirations towards finding that role or that kind of genre thing that would be your big franchise?
KENNY JOHNSON: I’ve always drams of doing something like Thor, the movie Thor, which I think they would give to somebody like Brad Pitt or something, but like a model character would be amazing for me. That would be like the ultimate— I see like a show coming up called Lights Out that FX is doing about a retired fighter that has to go back to fight. I don’t really know the storyline, but I think he comes out of retirement to fight. I’ve been trying to get this movie going about Jerry Quarry that I got approached five years ago to play the part of Jerry Quarry. That got me into boxing like five years ago. I think I’ve been really intrigued with the Jerry Quarry movie, which we’re still trying to make happen. I think things to do with— I would love to do the movie about a boxer or a fighter like Lights Out. I think that interests me a lot. But if you gave me a part like—obviously if Michael Bay or somebody did Indiana Jones or Spielberg, a part like that would be pretty amazing, but I would say something in that respect.
Q: When you first get a script, what’s your process of going through it?
KENNY JOHNSON: My process of going through it, I’ll read the script. I’m a slow reader. I have dyslexia so it takes me quite a while to read a script. I take notes on it. I then I will read it again and again and again. I just start taking notes of things I really need to know to follow exactly what Kurt is trying to say in the entire episode. Then from that point, I have somebody help me memorize it and I do a ton a character work on my own. I’ll spend hours writing little freebased thoughts about my character and my points of view towards all the other people and build a complete back history. I will constantly write every day to keep that kind of alive for me. That way whatever he writes for me as a character, I have at least in the back of my mind, I’ve filled it up as much as I can. It helps me to memorize that way. The more I know my character, the easier it is to memorize it and know exactly how you fit in and your point of view for each scene and each character.
Q: What’s your advice to actors, just someone who’s trying to maybe move out to L.A. and wants to make a go of it?
KENNY JOHNSON: My personal advice is that if you feel— I always felt like there was a seed planted somewhere inside of me. When that was revealed to me, I knew that maybe what I was supposed to do. I don’t look at it as putting a time limit on it. I don’t look at it as a competition. I just look at it as you work as hard as you can to be as prepared as you can for an actor. The more work you do on yourself and put into learning about acting and characters and everything you could possibly do, the more it sets you up to be prepared for it when something comes up that’s supposed to be yours. I believe there are projects and characters that are supposed to be yours. As long as you have a belief in that and you don’t buy into, “Oh this is so hard. There’s so many people. What makes you think you can be an actor?” It’s about not caring about who rejects you or whatever. It’s like you do what you want to do and don’t let anyone tell you any different. That’s what I believe.
Q: I saw the season finale and it rocked my world. I thought it was just—blew me away. When you saw the script, did you know it was going to be happening? What was your take on the season finale? I know you can’t give anything away. I don’t do spoilers, so I’m not going to do any spoilers. What was your take on the final episode, so I can whet people’s appetite for it?
KENNY JOHNSON: There’s a lot of twists and turns that happen. Reading it, I kept thinking Jax—I can’t say it, but yes, you think okay Jax maybe turned. Maybe all these guys got screwed. There were all these things that I thought was going to happen and then all of a sudden, the whole thing twists in another direction at the end. It comes together like it was a big master— Well, I’m not going to say that either. It was crazy. It was crazy. Kurt always comes up with a phenomenal finale. The fact that he directs it for some reason, man, he’s an amazing director. The guy … he’s a great creator, but I think he’s a great director, too. I have not seen it obviously, but visually, I think it’s going to be great. It’s very twisted and it gets complicated and complex, yet at the end it’s just like you’re like, “Oh, my God.” That’s how I read it. I thought it’s brilliant. I think it’s very good. He’s a great guy. I don’t know, I’m trying to think because I really don’t want to say anything that would give anything away.
